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  #21  
Old 10-31-2014, 05:39 PM
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AVENGER AVENGER is offline
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Outsourcing is ALWAYS a risk,, and I believe that any business or manufacturer MUST take risks in order to survive.
THAT'S how I reconcile that statement.... No need to agree with me Mike. My opinions aren't up for debate.

Furthermore NOTHING in my statement about TAXES being high said ANYTHING about condoning theft.

Personally I never speculated a damn thing about how this clone came to be,,, but let's put this into perspective. The product exists.. Maybe it's time to see how your price can become a little more affordable.
There is one reason and one reason alone that your product has cornered the market for ecu flashing especially on EVO-x and Ralliarts. It's the best and from what I've seen,,, it's the only one that exists that can flash these particular cars on the "private consumer market". I'm not talking about tuning shops..

By the way,, my car,, is not a multi-thousand dollar experiment like some of the others I've seen. I'm just looking to do a conservative tune.
I'm also married,, so I have HER chirping in my ear if I spent too much,, even on cookies or delicious cakes..
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  #22  
Old 10-31-2014, 05:48 PM
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By the way Mike, I'm not looking to make enemies with you,, not in any way, shape or form.. I'm sure you are a great guy and by all means may GOD BLESS your company with a prosperous future.
This whole discussion for me is basically a "money talks" matter.
I can, however guarantee that when my financial matters get back to the way they use to be,,,,, and they will,,, I will be buying your product anyway.
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  #23  
Old 10-31-2014, 06:23 PM
MikeyPSF MikeyPSF is offline
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"Maybe it's time to see how your price can become a little more affordable."

I don't personally see it that way but that's a valid argument. To play devil's advocate, what's the dollar amount that you think gets someone to the point of feeling like using stolen hardware/software/firmware isn't okay anymore? I guess to me, it's either okay to use stolen stuff or it isn't and us adjusting our price isn't going to make those who haven't bought our product up until now feel like they can support us if they can only save $20 dollars more. To put it as straightly as I can, there is no way we can even come close to the dollar amount the counterfeit Alibaba unit is being sold for unless we start some elaborate licensing and fees around our future software releases, which isn't the experience we want our customers to have. We want people who have trusted us enough to buy our hardware to be able to use whatever version of our software they want, and for them to have free upgrades for life. We make our money on the hardware and our software still supports the hardware we made in 2005. We even support OpenPort 2.0 units that were purchased second hand years ago. If they new owner breaks off the USB connector by jamming their knee in to it while it's plugged in to the OBD2 port, we try to fix it for free. We can't do free repairs, answer questions all day, spend countless hours developing software to give away, and sell hardware for the same cost as a Chinese manufacturer who doesn't have to do any firmware/hardware/software development so we aren't going to try. We'll keep doing what we do for as long as we can do it. If at some point we can no longer do it, we'll move on to something new.


"By the way Mike, I'm not looking to make enemies with you"

Same here. For the sake of starting the weekend off on the right foot, lets just agree to disagree on a number of points. Just to show you there are no hard feelings, if you find your pirated OpenPort doesn't work as you'd hoped, send me a message and I'll set you up with a discount
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  #24  
Old 10-31-2014, 06:55 PM
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AVENGER AVENGER is offline
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One last thing Mike, and then I'm done with this conversation.

Quote:
what's the dollar amount that you think gets someone to the point of feeling like using stolen hardware/software/firmware isn't okay anymore?
I did not do a google search for Tactrix openport 2.0 with intentions of finding it on aliexpress and buying stolen hardware/software/firmware.
You really shouldn't direct that statement or question toward the consumer. I am not the one that stole your technology. I or anyone else would have no way of knowing if you made any deals overseas with another company to manufacture your devices. Again,,, I was not speculating on how this clone/knock-off/counterfeit came to be.

Anyway,, I appreciate your offer of a discount, but it is not necessary.
However,, if you are in the discounting mood,, you can always peruse the forum and message someone in need of one and offer them the discount that you offered me.

If the device I ordered does not serve me as expected, I will gladly order one at full price to show good faith to you.
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  #25  
Old 10-31-2014, 07:20 PM
MikeyPSF MikeyPSF is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVENGER View Post
I did not do a google search for Tactrix openport 2.0 with intentions of finding it on aliexpress and buying stolen hardware/software/firmware.
I really didn't think you did. My point here is to let people know it is counterfeit and what the facts are, not to try and dissect how this unit came about or how you found it. We agree that is irrelevant. Look at us finding common ground


Quote:
Originally Posted by AVENGER View Post
You really shouldn't direct that statement or question toward the consumer.
I'm not exactly sure what statement or question you're referring to, but I think it's totally fair for me to clear up confusion when it's being debated on a public forum that a product may or may not be legitimate or that we may or may not have been working with crappy overseas suppliers that may have ripped us off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AVENGER View Post
I am not the one that stole your technology.
Agreed. Not until you install our software after agreeing to the simple license terms are you involved in any stealing.

“2. When used with a hardware interface, the software is to be used solely with OpenPort vehicle interfaces from Tactrix Inc. or other officially licensed interfaces. These sales fund the project development and keep the cost of such a tool reasonable.”


Quote:
Originally Posted by AVENGER View Post
If the device I ordered does not serve me as expected, I will gladly order one at full price to show good faith to you.
Sounds good. Thanks for the discussion and happy Halloween!

-Mike
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  #26  
Old 10-31-2014, 07:37 PM
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Good discussion my friend.. Happy Halloween to you also..
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  #27  
Old 10-31-2014, 08:58 PM
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echo4papa echo4papa is offline
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It's a shame, as I was looking forward to using the basemaps on my Ralliart for Christmas with this less expensive option. Knowing it's production amounts to theft of the work that other members of the community have put in, I can not, in good faith, support this product.

I'll just have to wait a little longer and order the real deal.

Thanks for setting the record straight, Mike.
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  #28  
Old 11-01-2014, 11:34 AM
MikeyPSF MikeyPSF is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echo4papa View Post
Thanks for setting the record straight, Mike.
No problem and thanks for your support. Much appreciated.
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  #29  
Old 11-01-2014, 01:04 PM
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All,
I appreciate the healthy discussion, without getting in to too much of an argument. I will try to stay unbiased in this discussion, even though I think some of the points suggesting the Openport should be built offshore to reduce price (and correspondingly, most likely quality) is absolutely ridiculous.

MikeyPSF,
I have edited the thread title to make absolutely certain this product is not confused with your company, and to clearly state it is a knock-off with stolen firmware.

!!!!!!!WARNING!!! MY OPINION ALERT!!!!!
Considering I am a Design Engineer by trade, this saddens me greatly. This type of thing happens all the time, but do not let yourself become ignorant or numb to the fact that it is ABSOLUTELY theft, and there is a reason that it is clearly illegal in the United States. A simple analogy would be farmer A who has raised and fed his beef cows for years, pouring money in to feed, water and proper care for the animals. Then, Farmer B comes along, steals half the cows that Farmer A has spent a great amount of time and money raising for market, only to sell his beef cheaper than Farmer A could possibly sell his beef for, considering the costs that he has dedicated to providing you the beef.
Personally, I'm buying beef from Farmer A.

Off the corny farm analogy, there is no way I would flash my car with a chinese knock-off Tactrix, and risk bricking my ECU.
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  #30  
Old 11-01-2014, 02:28 PM
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Markspd6 Markspd6 is offline
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Damn, looks im gonna be the one to play devils advocate here.. Now if im wrong, ill be fine with being corrected, cuz im not much of a tech or legal genius... But,

Isnt your product a basic violation of the user agreement we make with mitsu when we buy their cars? And you as a company cant afford to accept liability for any problems that arise from using it, and thats why the software is free? I say this only because installing your software, is an instant warranty killer.

Sorry to put it out like that, cuz i appreciate your contributions to the scene as well, im only trying to keep a little perspective on the situation.

And serioulsy thanks for the mitsu unit/software as my last car is a mazda speed6 and the only option is the AP, so cobb has an absolute stranglehold on the tuning scene bacause of that..
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